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Message posted by NegNwe on April-10-2003 at 7:50pm - IP Logged
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| NegNwe |
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Standard Member
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Haiti
October-11-2002
134 Posts |
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I disagree with you. Voodoo is an integral part of Haitian culture whether the world likes it or not, and whether other Haitians like it or not. The only reason many Haitians are uncomfortable with Voodoo is because the so called "Western" world has made them feel this way. Instead of being ashamed of voodoo (as you are), you should just educate others and teach them that Voodoo is just another form of worship. Being educated about exactly what Voodoo is does not mean you have to condone it or practice it. As Haitians, we need to stop being ashamed about such an important aspect of our culture.
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Se NegNwe ki la wi! Mwen pa nan jwet!
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Message posted by kreyolbro on April-10-2003 at 8:31pm - IP Logged
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| kreyolbro |
Standard Member
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United States
November-11-2002
178 Posts |
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Jbagelais; I am trying to get your point, correct me if I am wrong.
It is more important to you what foreigners think than the emancipation of our people by recognizing their religion and according it equal status.
Imagine if the early Christians gave up their faith because of the incredible persecution and ridicule they encountered.
Imagine if Jews went undercover after the progroms, the inquisitions, the holocost and other atrocities against them because of their faith.
Vaudou is not the reason for the lack of respect; Haiti's status is. A prosperous, educated and healthy Haiti with Vaudou as one of its religion will get respect.
Hinduism, Budhism, Taoism, and other Eastern religions have many religious traditions and quirks that can seem quite peculiar or weird to the western eye. Yet they are given some sort of respect because these societies demand respect. They honor their traditions, they build temples, and they don't accept foreign religious domination. Furthermore they are backed by great civilisations and economic powers; India, China, Japan etc.
To show you the extent of this anti-Haiti bias; they have even tried to elevate the other similar religions ( santeiria from Cuba, and Macumba from Brazil) above Haitian Vaudou. Many books on Santeiria or Macumba will tell you 'this is not Voodoo" as if to bring respectability.
The world does not respect Vaudou because Haiti's ruling classes do not. Poor Haitians are mistreated around the Caribbean because we mistreat them at home, and so on and on....
Don't sell your people or your culture short. You will get nothing in return from those you are trying to impress. They will never respect you or your country until you earn it. The only way to earn it is by improving the condition of the average Haitian, by celebrating our culture, and more importantly by standing up when your people's culture and religion is attacked. That same article that brought you so much shame has probably enlighten many non-Haitian who will say 'the vodoo religion" for the first time.
I say this recognition is long overdue and the next step should be the construction of a Great Temple.
kreyolbro@aol.com
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Message posted by kreyolbro on April-10-2003 at 9:10pm - IP Logged
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| kreyolbro |
Standard Member
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United States
November-11-2002
178 Posts |
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Amber,
As a student of history, you should take a look into early Christian, Judaic, and Islamic practices. Simply read the bible; it is full of blood, sacrifices, killings, stonings, and mayhem. Or look at some of the current practices of some Eastern religions. Vaudou is a relatively young religion, it has a lot of evolving and modernizing to do. Humanism and the enlightement are responsible for bringing those religious excesses in check in the West.
It took those older religions centuries to create the economic structure to be able to do material good and bad in some instances. In Vaudou's case it has been a strugle for survival in the face of slavery followed by blatant internal racism. Some religions do not have schools and hospitals and yet no one would dare question their authenticity.
Amber you really need to educate yourself on that religion; there is a meaning behind the mud bath as there is a meaning behind many christian, Muslim, Hindu and Budhist practices. How about the subjugation and mutilation of women in Islam, the deprivation of sexuality in the Christian priesthood, the bathing in the filthy rat infested Ganges river in Hinduism. Would you also say these have noyhing to do with worshiping God.
I don't believe in God nor Satan, so I am not defending one religious belief against another. What I will fight for is the right of my people to have a say on how they see the world and their place in it. The right for them to be as ridiculous as the Christian, the Moslem, the Hindu, the Satan worshippers, the Trekies, and many others and not feel bad or ashamed about it.
kreyolbro@aol.com
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Message posted by jbagelais on April-10-2003 at 9:45pm - IP Logged
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| jbagelais |
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Standard Member
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United States
December-04-2002
22 Posts |
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Negnwe, I am not ashamed of voodoo, as your incorrectly stated. I do know that it plays an important role in the haitian culture. But you must understand, voodoo in countries such as the United States is not seen in the same light as haitians view it. Voodoo in this country comes with many negative connotations. Many see it as black magic and of something which is connected with holidays such as Halloween.
Kreyolbro, are religions such as Shintoism, buddhism and other religions you mentioned ridiculed to the extent that voodoo has? Are movies such as Serpent and the Rainbow forms of media which we should ignore, for we know it is not true? No, we should not ignore it and we should not be content to see that these are the only images presented.
This reminds me of a point in American history when the only images of black social life were depictions of cartoonish figures such as mammies, uncle toms, coons, wild bucks,etc. Although these images were false they were the only images in which the American people saw, and they were seen as being truthful. African-americans continue to fight these portrayals till this very day. If they wanted to, they could have just let these images linger, for they would know internally that they weren't true and that they weren't the only aspects of african-american experience. But they didn't, they fought them. I wouldn't label this fight trying to impress anyone.
My stance on this issue does not rely upon impressing anyone but when a country such as Haiti has so many perplexing issues which could have been reported on, why is it that an article on the religion of voodoo makes front page? Why not a front page article on the things being done to combat the AIDS/HIV virus in the western hemisphere's poorest country? Why not a front page article on former pres. Clinton's visit to Haiti regarding this epidemic?
This article is not meant to present Haitians in a positive way. It is meant to bring about shock and awe, primarily the reason why it was on the homepage of that website. In conclusion, I have absolutely no problem nor am I ashamed of the voodoo religion. But when it continues to be the predominant thing associated with haitains and when it is presented in a way to bring about emotions of shock and disbelief, I have a big problem with that.
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Message posted by Guest on April-10-2003 at 9:53pm - IP Logged
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| Guest |
Standard Member
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October-03-2002
1436 Posts |
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I dont particularly see why homeboy thinks it's some type of insult. The outside world in general seem to have a particular facination with voudou. People who have never heard of Haiti has heard of Voudou, there are hundreds of books, a few that are very popular written about Haitian Voudou. I beleive Voudou is good for Tourism, youd be surprised how many people come from around the world to study Haitian Voudou. I think your perspective is a HaitianAmerican perspective, you seem very defensive "there talking about Voudou so they must be putting us down", Im impresed that they have been following voudou close enough to even know about it. I guess out of all the issues they could have talked about, they decided to pick what was most interesting to them and probably to most outsiders. Ive noticed that Haitians tend to speak badly of Voudou to disacosiate and most outsiders seem to be more curious. This attempt to disacosiate is probably based on the HaitianAmericans pre-conceived notions on the outsiders view of Voudou. One time I went to a Boukman Experianse concert and noticed that most of the crowd was white and Asian. I meet people in college, usually white who are very interested and sometimes studying Hinduism, Taoism and Voudou. White people seem to be more interested in it then African Americans who usually have something derogatory to say. Since most HaitianAmericans live around and go to school in areas with African Americans, they llearn to be very defensive. No matter who brings it up. The fact that Voudou has been persecuted at Haiti is a whole different story which is probably the foundation for the defensivenes of the Haitian in the U.S. In general Haiti still seems to be wresteling with the fact that it is one of the most, probably the most African country in the Americas. Because the European used to be in power and he hated the African and deligitimized the Africans religion. So when former slaves assume that power they deligitimize the religion because there immitating the only power they had ever known. A perfact example is Creole, Haiti's language. But for a long time it was considered Haiti's second language. Because Creole is the language of Haiti and French is the language of power and those in power want to represent power.
~~~~~~1804-2004~~~~~~
Yo Seizi! |
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Topic: Legalized Voodoo
